Krell Evo 402e vs ARC Ref 210 vs Krell FPB700cx

marck1973 -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 05:15

Hi,
I am currently debating whether to listen to a couple of new power amplifier's, however once you start on that slippery slope there is normally only one way to go!
I have been using a Krell FPB700cx in my system (consisting of ARC Ref5, ARC CD8, SummitX) and do enjoy the presentation very much. However I have started to wonder what the difference would be in one of the newer amplifiers, such as the Evo 402e or the Ref 210.
Has anyone had any experience in comparing these power amplifier with the FPB? I am aware that the tube amp will present a much more warmer, spacey sound than the solid state. Also has anyone heard the new tubes that ARC are now using for the 6550C?
Much appreciated
Marc.

SundayNiagara -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 08:41

What kind of music do you listen to and how big is your room?

marck1973 -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 08:49

I mainly listen to femal vocals - such as Diana Krall, Eva Cassidy, Rosa Passos, Nina Simone etc etc. So ranging from Jazz to Folk.

My room is 7.5m long and 5.5m wide. I will try and upload a photo to show layout
Thanks
Marc.

SundayNiagara -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 08:51

No problem, get the 210's and you'll never look back.

marck1973 -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 09:00

Upload too large, will try smaller file!

SundayNiagara -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 08:54

Another option would be a used pair of REF300's, (there are several on audiogon) a call to Leonard at ARC would be in order to see if these amps can accomodate the new KT120's.

marck1973 -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 08:58

Not sure the last upload worked..

SundayNiagara -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 09:05

You must be married!

marck1973 -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 09:15

Yes, sure am! So how can you tell?!

So you reckon the ARC will out perform the Krell (both FPB and Evo)?
M.

SundayNiagara -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 09:25

No room treatment!

Yes, and you might also want to consider the REF110, which should be fine for the types of music you listen to.

marck1973 -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 09:46

OK, looks like a demo needs to be arranged. Are there any other amplifiers you recommend trying - VTL, Pass Labs etc?
With regard to the room treatments what would you recommend? The room is meant to be 'my' listening room, evening though when married that is never really the case :) However I may be able to do a little persuading :)
Thanks
M.

SundayNiagara -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 12:13

Regarding room treatment, check with Art Noxon at ASC.

As far as amps are concerned, stick with ARC. However, you might want to consider upgrading to the REF40 pre amp.

PS: No analog?

marck1973 -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 12:29

Unfortunately the REF40 is outside of my budget :(
So in your opinion the Ref210 with the new tubes will beat anything else at that price point?
I will contact Art at ASC
M.

SundayNiagara -- Tue, 01/25/2011 - 13:01

I gave you several options and would seriously consider a used pair of REF300's, instead of the new '210s.

marck1973 -- Wed, 01/26/2011 - 08:52

Much appreciated - I will look into both options you mention
Rgds
Marc.

Elliot Goldman -- Wed, 01/26/2011 - 10:38

THe new KT120 tubes make a substantial diofference in the sound and the ability of the amps to play with a greater sense of "ease".
I have had both in my showroom and the new tubes make a big difference. I believe they are much better than the 300's.
You also might want to look at the McIntosh 2301 amps they are also really excellent. I am not sure where you live and what is available for you to see and hear .

marck1973 -- Wed, 01/26/2011 - 11:21

Hi Elliot,

Thak you for your input. I am based in London, Uk so am lucky that i can get to hear most things.

My current idea is to demo the Ref210 and 402e, however speaking with a friend they suggested I try the Ref110 as well - especially now that it will extra power.
What is you experience with these against the FPB700cx that I currently have?
Thank you
Marc.

Elliot Goldman -- Wed, 01/26/2011 - 11:27

Krell makes a good product however I really prefer the sound of tubes and with the speakers you own I think you will as well.
I think the newer Krell is far superior to what you have. I have not heard the latest amsp, post Dan, but I did have the 600's and 900's at my shop and they are very good sounding amps. The new tubes in the REF 210 really amazed me in the fact that they sound really powerfuland play with a greater sense of ease and with no strain. I had had the earlier amps, and my speakers are harder to drive than yours, and they could be pushed to sound a bit strained. The new tubes eliminate that sennsation.
Try to listen to them and if you can the Macs and see which you prefer. They will both do a great job with the pre you have and the speakers.

marck1973 -- Wed, 01/26/2011 - 11:59

I have put a call into my dealer and we will await the new ARC's with the KT-120 tubes (apparently there aren't any over here yet!)

Also, would you know if there are any plans to update the 210 with a new model to specifically accomodate the new power of the tubes?
Thanks agaon
M.

Elliot Goldman -- Wed, 01/26/2011 - 12:01

As far as I know there is none. They have put those tubes in a lot of the amps including the 610, 210, 110, VSi-60 etc.and they have not changed the designation only raised the price a bit

marck1973 -- Wed, 01/26/2011 - 12:07

ok cool - wouldn't want to buy something that was due to be replaced imminently :)

aliveatfive -- Wed, 01/26/2011 - 12:17

I had a pair of original Summits which were driven by an ARC Ref 110. I was somewhat unsatisfied with the sound of that pairing for quite a while. IMHO, I think the ultra low impedance of the Summits at high frequences renders this a questionable match. I've since replaced the speakers with Nola Metro Refs and find the difference to be large. I've also changed the amp outputs to KT 120s. The high end of the new speakers is much better defined in my new set-up. This is, of course, only one man's opinion. Audition for yourself and please report your findings.
Seth