Can use some advice on my analogue front end
Syd -- Thu, 06/12/2008 - 11:26
I replaced my VPI TNT 3.5 Table/JMW 12 Tonearm for an Avid Acutus Table/SME V Tonerarm in my system. I kept the same cartridge (for the time being) which is an older Lyra Clavis. The results, unfortunately, have gone in the wrong direction. With my TNT/JMW combo I had full bodied rich 3-D analogue performance. By compariosn I have more of a thin, light and 2-D or "collapsed" sound with my Avid Acutus/SME V combo.
I heard the Avid/SME combo in multiple systems over the years and was impressed with its performance. My other requirements were that the table needed a small footprint to fit directly on my equipment rack without needing a seperate oversized shelf (which the TNT required), and it had to be aestheticly pleasing for me to look at. The Avid seemed to fit the bill. The cartridge I heard this combo with, however, was the Dynavector XV1S. Logic would seem to dictate that this is where the problem lies and replacing my Lyra Clavis with the Dynavector should help, although I am not sure.
I had an analogue buddy of mine come over for a second opinion. He checked out my setup which turned out to be right on the money. When he listened to the system, he thought that the SME V may need to be replaced (with the likes of a Triplanar VII) as well as mating it with a Shelter or Air Tight cartridge.
I know that the SME V/Dynavector XV1S mates well and that the Triplanar/Shelter cartridges mate well.
So here's my dilemna:
1. Should I go down one of the tonearm cartridge mating paths?
2. Is the SME tonearm cable the possible culprit?
3. Do I just say the hell with it and ditch the Table/Arm altogether and go back to a VPI or some other table/arm setup that works better with my system?
I am open to all suggestions and would love to hear from the analogue experienced among you!
Here is the rest of my system for reference:
Sources
- Avid Acutus Turntable/SME V Tonerarm (with SME tonerarm cable)/Lyra Clavis cartridge
- Magnum Dynalab MD-109 Tuner
- Audio Research CD2
Amplification
- Spectral DMC-12 preamp with phono (being used as an out board phonostage only)
- Spectral DMC-30SL linestage preamp
- Spectral DMA 150 Mk II amplifier
- Stax SRM-007t Headphone amplifier
Speakers/Headphones
- Avalon Eidolon Loudspeakers
- Stax SR-007 Headphones
Interconnects/Cables/Conditioners
- Spectal/MIT Interconnect cables
- MIT Oracle V1.1 Speaker Cable
- MIT Z Systems Conditioners
- MIT Power Cords
Racks
- Zoethecus Equipment/Amp Stands with z Slab shelves
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The Dynavector XV-1S is an outstanding cartridge in the right arm. It works particularly well in the Basis Vector 4, the set-up I'm using at the moment (on a Basis 2800 Signature). You might think about a Basis table; I think they offer the highest performance for the price of all the makes.
Evidently the XV1S works particularly well with the SME V as well from what I am told. Given what you have suggested, I suppose I can start with the XV1S on my table/arm as a first step, and if that doesn't do the trick, switch tables out as step 2.
It would be nice to try and isolate the problem with my system, so I may just want to switch the table out only in step 2
I know that VPI tables mate well with SME tonearms. Do you know if the Basis tables do? Or do you think I'm being a bit pedastrian with this approach and should just replace what I have with the Basis/Vector/XV1S combo and call it a day?
I don't know that 'table, but it's worth a try before starting over. I also don't know about using an SME arm on the Basis tables.
From my experience, you won't be disapointed in the Basis/Vector/Dynavector combination.
Thanks for the advice Robert. It may be a while until I get to this, but when I do I will let you and evryone else know how it turns out.
You have assembled an impressive system and I'm sorry to hear you're not getting the results you had hoped.
Before throwing the Acutus/SME overboard, I would try:
- a different cartridge. I really think the Clavis may be the culprit here. You have very neutral electronics, and the Clavis can be somewhat lean so you may want to try a cartridge with a bit more warmth. A Koetsu might just do the trick for you or perhaps the new Sumiko Celebration II.
- a different tonearm cable. Some have reported the SME cable can be a bit thin sounding. You might try the Cardas Golden Reference phono cable. It's not too expensive and I have tried it with SME table/arm combos to good effect.
The Acutus was designed with the SME arm in mind and should be quite a synergistic combination to dissipate spurious resonnaces. I would leave that alone and try the suggestions above, first.
Also, the TNT 3.5 is on the darker, lusher sounding side so you don't have that to counter-balance the Clavis.
Good luck!
Jim
Jim: Thank you so much for the compliment on my system and your insight on my table/arm/cartridge combo!
I was wondering what your opinion of replacing the Clavis with the Dynavector XV1S cartridge would be (as opposed to the Koetsu or Sumiko)? I understand this is also a synergistic combo with the SME V/Acutus, but I'm not sure how it would play with the rest of my "neutral" system as you put it.
It seems that Robert is using this cartridge to good effect in his basis/vector combo feeding a Spectral/Wilson system which I would also put in the neutral category.
Syd: Unfortunately, I have never used the Dyna XVIS cart, but I would suggest you call MusicDirect. They have a lot of experience with the Acutus. I believe they were using the Dyna cart with the Acutus at CES, but I didn't have the opportunity to carefully audition that system.
Hopefully, you have some good dealer support nearby. Things are not as they once were, but if you are serious, I would think a dealer may let you audition the Dyna (or other carts, too?) in your system. Perhaps I'm dreaming?
Best of luck and let us know what you decide/find.
Jim
The Music Direct guys are all over the Dynavector - they love it with the Acutus/SME V. There are a couple of Dynavector dealers in my area as well. Once I make my move I'll post the results.
Thanks again for your help.
The Dynavector XV1S is extremely dynamic, lively, detailed, exciting, and transparent. Its bottom-end slam is phenomenal. I moved to the XV1S from a Transfiguration Orpheus, a cartridge at the other end of the spectrum. What it lacks in dynamics it makes up with sheer ease and beauty of timbre.
Sounds like Syd could use some more "ease and beauty of timbre" in his system which is why I suggested the Koetsus and Celebrations (that new unnamed one with the Pao Ferro body that was being shown at CES was quicker, quieter, and more resolved than previous Celebrations I've had the pleasure of using).
I guess this begs the question, "Can a system be too neutral?"
(Please be kind in your responses)
Jim
Jim Hannon asked:
"I guess this begs the question, "Can a system be too neutral?""
My semi-smug response would be:
"It all depends on our source material."
If you listen primarily to aggressive pop recordings absolute neutrality might make much of your music less listenable than if your system sweetened and softened things up some.
Let's face it, with rare exceptions (mostly found on HP's lists) most recordings fall into "Holt's Law" - the better the performance, the worse the recording, and vice versa.
:shock:
Steven Stone
Contributor to The Absolute Sound, EnjoytheMusic.com, Vintage Guitar Magazine, and other fine publications
StevenStone1 wrote:
"It all depends on our source material . . .
Let's face it, with rare exceptions (mostly found on HP's lists) most recordings fall into "Holt's Law" - the better the performance, the worse the recording, and vice versa.
Yes, you make a very good point about the quality of the source material.
Not sure I agree with Holt's Law, but there are lots of audiophile recordings gathering dust in my listening room (and garage) because the performances are less than stellar (with a few exceptions).
However, many of the Golden Age classical recordings combine great performances with very good sound. Of course, many of the Mercury recordings from that era would not "help" Syd's problem. The massed strings are not what I'd call "lush" and I prefer the sound of the strings on RCA Shaded Dogs from that era. Many of the top mono recordings from the 50's (and some 60's) combine great performances with surprisingly good sound, too.
Jim
The Dynavector is a tremendous cartridge, but it is highly revealing. I'm with Jim: I suspect the Clavis may be the culprit here. An Air Tight PC-1 might actually be the solution, as it is a fuller sounding cartridge. The Avid is a very well-engineered table.
The Air Tight PC-1 is an incredible cartridge. It seems to have it all without being the least bit lean. Soundstaging and focus are first rate and it gets the sound of massed strings right. Wish I had one.
Jim
jimhannon1 wrote:The Air Tight PC-1 is an incredible cartridge. It seems to have it all without being the least bit lean. Soundstaging and focus are first rate and it gets the sound of massed strings right. Wish I had one.
Jim
Hmm. I wonder if an upgrade from my aging Lyra Parnassus (the original, not the Dct version) would help my system's perceived leaness problem? The PC-1 would be at the top of what I could push myself to--assuming The Boss (aka "wife") doesn't veto it! :-)
If you are stil considering upgrading your original (blue body) Parnassus, I might be able to help as I am looking for one.
You can contact me on bert_denckens [at] yahoo [dot] com
kind regards.
Bert
@RichTeer
If you are stil considering upgrading your original (blue body) Parnassus, I might be able to help as I am looking for one.
You can contact me on bert_denckens [at] yahoo [dot] com
kind regards.
Bert
Alas, recent unemployment means that all upgrades have been put on hold indefinitely. :-( Fortunately, I managed to sneak a speaker upgrade to the MartinLogan Spires just in time!
If you can't get approval for the Air Tight PC-1 (I can't), you might try a mid-range Koetsu or Benz or one of the new Celebrations. I'd certainly experiment with carts before tossing your whole rig overboard.
Good luck!
Jim
So it seems like the Dynavector versus Air Tight might be the way to widdle down my options. The problem of course is that these are expensive cartiridges that would be difficult for a dealer to let me A-B on my system to see which one works best. I could just choose one and hope for the best, but that could turn out to be a $4k+ mistake if I'm wrong.
The trials and tribulations of analogue...